QsoNet Discussions

[VE7KEY]

I love this program and it works very well on my tower computer using the wdm-ks driver. On my laptop the program works if I select the Sound direct driver but if I try to use the wdm-ks driver I get an error 9996 and says can not open sound card.I have the Intel(r) 82801ca/cam-ac97 integrated sound card and running XP Home p4 Intel proccessor 1.8 G and 512 Ram Any Ideas???? Frank VE7KEY

[W7RJR]

Whether it be a driver or hardware limitation I have found many of the laptop integrated sound cards to only allow one application at a time to access the sound card (error 9996).

This would preclude using CQ100 and dah-di-dah executables from running simultaneously. If you find a fix please let us know as my laptop behaves the same way.

73

[VE3EFC]

I have 2 Dell computers, Windows XP, model 4500, five years old and both with the SoundBlaster Live, PCI card. With one computer the CQ100 audio will not work when Dahdidah is set to WDM-KS. The other computer works fine. The difference I see is the one that allows CQ100 to work is using the Creative drivers, while the problem computer is using the generic Windows drivers. I have not tried ASIO4All on these computers.

[KB4T]

I too suffer from the apparent inability of my notebook PC to share its sound card with both CQ100 and Dahdidah.

I had no trouble whatsoever making Dahdidah work with my desktop PC. It was easy and the Dahdidah software works very well. I can use my bug, straight key or paddle and get excellent results.

Then I tried it on my notebook PC. The Notebook is a 2 year old Toshiba Satellite Pentium 4 - 3.20 GHz, 448 MB RAM, Windows XP Home 2002 SP2 with NO SERIAL PORT...only 3 USB Ports. The Sound Card is integrated on the system board and is a RealTek AC97 series device.

Running alone Dahdidah works well with the Hardware set to the Realtek AC97 sound card, Driver set to Windows WDM-KS and a USB to Serial adapter connecting the same cable I used on my desktop PC. Nice tone and smooth easy keying.

Then I fired up CQ100.... Immediately I noticed that I wasn't hearing any audio in CQ100. Shut down Dahdidah and receive audio from CQ100 returns. Everything I tried to make the two programs work properly failed. My experiments included downloading, installing and using the ASIO4ALL driver software. It worked but again no audio when CQ100 was run. Same problem as with any other driver. Only one app can use the sound card.

Then I read the note here that it's fairly common for notebook sound cards to be multi-application challenged. What a bummer!!!

Evidently this is a deal killer because no one has posted a fix and I'm not even sure where to look for possible answers. Until some kind of solution is found, my alternate plan involves much more hardware to carry with the notebook.......

My MFJ 554 Sine Wave Output Code Practice Oscillator keyed by a straight key or bug works very well. The interface is simple: connect the external speaker output of the code practice oscillator to the line in or mic in on the pc with a .1 microfarad cap in series. Too easy!

I like the flexibility of being able to send with either a straight key, bug or keyer as the mood strikes. Sine wave audio is ESSENTIAL to avoid pops, clicks and buzzes. Sure I could use the keyboard but I don't like typing CW. I prefer to actually send it myself. Call me fickle or even old fashioned but that's what brings me joy.

I hope some sort of fix, patch or workaround can be found to allow Dahdidah to work simultaneously with CQ100 on the more retarded notebooks. Perhaps a second, external USB sound card??? Is there even such a thing?

From the program side, I wonder if some sort of hook can be established between Dahdidah and CQ100 that would allow one or the other to "take over" the sound card with the user given the ability to switch between them. I dunno. I'm not a programmer. Is this possible?

73,

Frank KB4T

[VE3EFC]

Hi Frank. Many thanks for your detailed report.

Did you try the MME or DirectSound settings? These setting should share the sound card, but you might notice a slight lag between your paddle movement and the sound you hear. Depending on the speed of your computer and the speed of your CW, you might be able to live with this lag.

I have the same problem you report on one of my Dell computers using the SoundBlaster live card. I have identical Dell with identical sound card are it shares the sound fine between Dahdidah and CQ100. The difference I see is the problem Dell is using the Windows generic sound card driver, while the good Dell is using the Creative Driver.

You could try plugging in a USB headset or USB speakers. These devices are actually a second sound card and they will appear on the Dahdidah pick list. Just an idea.

Good luck,
Doug

[WB0WLS]

I have been using an external sound card with my laptop now for a few weeks. N4LCC, Dave told me about it. I was having trouble with static on my sound card causing extreme breakup problems on tx and rx when running CW. The sound card totally eliminated the static.

Maybe that is why my laptop is working ok with the Dahdidah software. I never have tried to use the new software without the external sound card.

It is the Turtle Beach Amigo sound card if anyone is interested ... it could be a solution to getting your laptop to allow you to run CQ100 and Dahdidah at the same time.

Frank... good to read your info. Look forward to seeing you again soon CW.

rich ae0v

[KB4T]

Doug et al:

When I realized that the Windows WDM-KS driver in Dahdidah and CQ100 could not work together I tried the other two driver options: MME and Windows DirectSound. Both produced the lag. I'm a higher speed operator. I like to work CW at 30 to 40 wpm. The lag makes that impossible.

I tried. I grit my teeth and worked at it but I simply could not send sensibly, even at low speeds with the lag. It completely hoses the timing needed to send decently. I gave up in frustration.

Interestingly, I can run CWType, CWGet and CQ100 all simultaneously and do keyboard CW using CWType to send, CWGet to watch and CQ100 running and all works well. The only anomaly is the fact that any adjustment of the REC GAIN in the CQ100 affects the audio output setting of CWType. I have to click on the WAV slider in the VOLUME CONTROL applet to get the transmit audio level back down to its proper spot. Haven't sorted that out but I did have a nice 35 wpm QSO with AE0V using all 3 apps simultaneously with occasional level "resetting" clicks at the start of a few transmissions.

It would seem to me that CWType and CQ100 are sharing the sound card in this scenario. Clearly CWType uses the sound card in a different way than Dahdidah.

I will look into the Turtle Beach Amigo external sound card and see what that will do for me. I travel a good bit and would like to be able to use Dahdidah while I'm on the road. It would be easier to do that than carry the Sine Wave Code Practice Oscillator and keyer along with the Straight Key, Bug and Keyer Paddle. Gonna need a second suitcase for all my QSONET hardware! ! ! ! !

Doug: I don't understand your suggestion about USB headsets or something else. Please give me more detail so I can understand what you are suggesting I try.

73 all around,

Frank KB4T
Florida

[VE3EFC]

Hi Frank. My suggestion about USB headsets etc. is the same suggestion as using the turtle beach device. A USB sound device gives your computer another sound card to work with.

CWType uses MME, just like typing cw into CQ100. MME will always share the sound card, and you do not notice the lag when you are typing on the keyboard.

High speed paddling requires low-lag Asio or WDM-KS to reduce the lag, but some sound cards refuse to share with other programs while they are running ASIO or KS.

[KB4T]

Doug et al (especially AE0V):

I ordered a Turtle Beach Audio Advantage Amigo USB external sound "card" today. I expect it will arrive some time next week.

When it arrives, I will endeavor to make it work with Dahdidah. Logic tells me that I will let CQ100 use the internal sound electronics in the notebook. I will configure Dahdidah to use the Amigo sound card with the Windows WDM-KS driver on whatever COM port the Amigo ends up on.

Does this sound like the right combination?

In order for this combo to happen I presume the order of things will be to fire up CQ100 first so it grabs the internal sound electronics. Then I plug in the external sound card and let the notebook configure it. Then run Dahdidah and configure the program to use the external Amigo audio card with the right driver and on the correct COM port.

Or can the external audio card be inserted as the notebook is being setup and started and still be able to configure things the way I need to????

If this doesn't prove how anxious I am to work manually generated CW while using CQ100 on the road, nothing does!!!!

AE0V: Do I have this all correct?????

Thanks to all. 73,

Frank KB4T
Florida

[WB0WLS]

Hi Frank. I just have the Turtle Beach Amigo plugged in "full time" and all sound settings (on CQ100, dahdidah and everyother program where you have a choice of sound cards) with the Amigo selected.

Believe me, I am no expert at any of this but I never thought of chosing one sound card for one application and the other one for something else. Maybe you could do it that way.

Try just using the Amigo as your "one and only" sound card on the laptop for EVERYTHING. For me, it has simply replaced the internal card.

rich ae0v

[KB4T]

Rich:

I understand what you are saying. I'll experiment and see what configuration actually works.

To do what you suggest, I would think that I would have to go into the Device Manager and disable the onboard integrated non-sharable-with-Windows WDM-KS sound card. Then be sure the USB sound card is inserted as the machine boots in order to hear all the sounds my notebook normally makes when it starts and runs.

I'll report back once I get the Amigo and see what color smoke it makes on my notebook.

Thanks & 73,

Frank KB4T
Florida

[WB0WLS]

Ok Frank... well, it seems you are maybe making it more difficult than it has to be. I leave the Amigo in 100% of the time... no pulling it out or putting it in after or before booting up the laptop, etc.

The only thing you have to do is select the Amigo sound card rather than the built in sound card from your menus with every program that uses sound.

For example ... when I first put in the sound card, CQ100 still was using the internal soundcard so I had to go to "audio output" and "audio input" on the cq100 and then instead of on the internal card listed there was now also the Amigo card listed so I had to select it in order for the sound to now come through the Amigo and my headphones.

If I wanted to listen to music Windows Media Player or Musicmatch Jukebox, I again had to go to the drop down menus on those programs and select the Amigo card rather than the built in card.

The new Amigo card automatically appears in your choices on any program that involves sound.... but until you select it, the built in card will continue to work.

On echolink, if I didn't make the new selection, the sound would continue to come from the laptop speakers instead of via the Amigo and the headphones plugged into the Amigo.

I'm probably telling you things you already very well know... sorry if that's the case.

rich

[KB4T]

Rich:

Thanks for the detailed explanation. I understand completely.

Since I travel a good bit, my notebook spends a fair amount of time in its carrying bag. I don't believe I can leave the Amigo plugged in full time since the fit of the bag is very snug. Everytime I setup the notebook I have to connect the power supply, cellular aircard, mouse and soon the Amigo. This is not a bad thing since the exercise keeps my brain and fingers working! The rest of the puzzle is how to fit all the hardware on the skimpy desktops offered in most hotel rooms!

My internal sound card works well. No issues other than it won't allow CQ100 and Dahdidah to share it. Dahdidah doesn't remember the setup (yet) so each time you run the program one has to choose the hardware parameters. Since Dahdidah is the only application which causes me to need the Amigo, and since I have to configure Dahdidah everytime I use it, choosing the Amigo is a simple matter.

With CQ100 automatically choosing the internal sound card and working well with it, I'm hoping that the process of choosing and using the Amigo will allow me the use of Dahdidah as intended. For all other applications, the internal sound card is satisfactory and doesn't require anything hanging off the notebook.

Your explanation answers my questions about setup and it would seem a simple matter to use the Amigo for the specific application. I will know soon when the Amigo arrives. I appreciate your response and advice. Thanks.

Hopefully my next notebook (in about 2 years) will be more cooperative.

73,

Frank KB4T
Florida

[WB0WLS]

Hi Frank... right, you can't leave the Amigo in when it's in the case, etc., but there is nothing to reset when you do plug it in once you initially make the settings on your laptop, they will reamin.

As for the Dahdidah software, you do have to reset it every time you open it up (choice of serial port, driver, start button, speed, etc. etc.). It doesn't retain those settings once you shut it down.

I should go back to my internal sound card settings and see if my CQ100 and dahdidah work together without the use of the Amigo.

rich

[WB0WLS]

Frank... I just tried changing back to my internal card and it does in fact react the same as yours. The Windows WDM-KS will not work but the Windows DirectSound does work. As for the delay, I don't notice much and also didn't try adjusting the Latency.

If I have just the Dahdidah open by it's self, it still won't work with the Windows WDM-KS. So it doesn't seem to be a problem of CQ100 and Dahdidah running at the same time.

I assume your Amigo will allow the WDM-KS to run as it does on mine.

rich